The false equivalency is yours, my friend. Anyway, this was an entirely unproductive discussion about my use of the word "relevant", and not the story itself, so that was fun wasn't it.

Khalid El-Amin. Famous basketball player. Not a famous NBA player.

Vassilis Spanoulis. Famous basketball player. Not a famous NBA player.

John Beilein. Famous basketball coach. Not a famous NBA coach.

Ellen Pompeo. Famous actress. Not a famous Friends actress.

Hope this helps you see delineation

It's all laid out there for you. Read it as many times as you need.

Same answer as before.

bsky.app/profile/mark...

....now, he was not well known *WITHIN* the NBA, i.e. by its fans, because he played a small bench role. Thus, he was not a famous NBA player. But he was a famous basketball player, who played in the NBA for two years.

My God I think we've finally reached the middle of this conversation.

You can of course realise - oh for the love of God, please realise - that to get into the NBA, you have to be really good. To be really good at a professional sport comes with fame. Kasun was well known in Europe before he played in the NBA. Making it, albeit briefly, added to that fame.....

Let's use the tick cross system again.

"He was not a famous NBA player "✅ correct so far, didn't get to a high level

"but playing in the NBA made him famous" ❌ it was *IN PART* what made him famous.

"but he wasn't very well know in the NBA" ✅ as above.

2 out of 3. a passing grade.

Famous in part because he was got in the NBA ✅
Famous by NBA standards ❌

Is this helping to do it in this style? Would you like a pie chart, an allegory? Help me to help you.

......yes. Yes it did. He was a famous basketball player. He was famous in part because he played in the NBA. It made him more famous, especially back home. It did not make him a well known NBA player, because he played neither often nor for long within it. You can surely, SURELY, work this one out.

Kasun was not a famous NBA player. Kasun was a famous basketball player, who briefly played in the NBA. The difference has always been noted and I'm probably going to get some tiresome guff about semantics now but, ehhhhhhhhhhh, fill your boots.

a man with a beard is smiling in front of a sign that says look at us ALT: a man with a beard is smiling in front of a sign that says look at us

I think we do, yes. Heyyyy, look at us, with all this mutual understanding.

With your help, maybe there is hope. Anyway, peace.

Pretty sure that's in the first paragraph, yes. Now try looking at it from a European point of view.

Oh no! I guess I'll struggle on.

I agree there is not much good to be gained from platforming the views of random people's bigotry. I also absolutely think two former NBA players giggling at the evil of gay pride on a successful podcast rises above the threshold of "random". You may not. But you haven't convinced me whatsoever.

This would be true, were Kasun unknown. But he is not.

This was painful. Paaaaaaaainful. Let's not do it again, eh?

John likes articles about homophobic NBA players! Just as long as he personally has heard of them.

And your opinion would appear to be, I personally need to know who someone is to care about what they say, even if what they say is bigoted.

I mean, sure, that's a position. But it's not a good one. You may not personally know or care about who this former fringe NBA player was/is. But, so what?

Yes, he is.

Would you like me to write articles that have already been written about these already-known stories?

I suspect I might have been right about your America-centric nature. Good talk, John.

What a tediously America-centric take this is.

I'm sorry the speaker of this particular bigotry isn't well known enough for you to care. Other opinions may vary.

This is frustratingly dumb. I guess if you can't see the fact that his status as an NBA player GAVE HIM FAME, even if it DID NOT CREATE HIS BELIEF SYSTEM, then there's no hope for this discussion.

...worth hearing from *any further*. I absolutely think what Kasun said should be heard. I am not interested in giving him the opportunity to double down.

Well then it's a good job I didn't call it that, then.

No one made you do anything, John.

I will happily write about any documented incidents of NBA homophobic behaviour you can help me find!

Which you seem to have somehow read as "Kasun must have gotten these views from being an NBA player". Which was never the point, ever, and yet which you've now whanged on about twice. Jesus this is frustrating, I might end up throwing that tantrum after all.