Sure. Agree with your first sentence.

Tax incidence always ends up with those who can't pass it on, it's like carpet bombing.

The MMT view of taxation is pretty much "set and forget".

Whenever govt wants to do something its options are always the same.

You should sound more MMT-ish, "whatever we can do, we can afford" is as true now as when Keynes said it.

It's always about real resources, not £s.

Also, tax incidence doesn't stop at the first instance, those who can pass tax increases on, will.

"Tax the rich" is useless, slogan politics.

Erm ...

Great!

I think we agree then - nothing to do with the EU is immutable; anything and everything can be altered.

Imagine understanding how currency works and still sticking up for private banking 🤦

I refer you to my earlier comment about political naivete in the MMT space.

So sometimes they can change things by everyone agreeing and sometimes a simple majority will do?

Great!

So now we know the treaty and any subordinate provisions are not immutable, right?

No. Of course they are part of a political class with norms/values.

I'm telling you if you think they are motivated by anything other than profit then you are delusional.

Do these "flexibility mechanisms" have to be voted on, and agreed by, all member states?

Lol, sure, I give up.

As I've always said, there are plenty of smart people in the MMT space but there's a huge amount of political naivety too.

Stay well 👍

Great!

So the provisions apply under all circumstances, right?

The politics is pantomime.

I think you are being naive. These organisations are arch capitalists, they are only interested in making as much money as possible.

I don't know what you are trying to say maybe you could explain it?

These institutions are driven by profit, that's all.

You might want to update your knowledge on that one.

Great!

Explain that in relation to the Stability and Growth Pact.

Of course it can arrange legislation in any way it chooses.

EU can change any legislation or treaty any time it sees fit; it is the body which determines it's legislation.

EU law is not some immutable law handed down from an external authority.

Really?

I apply for a loan and I specify it's for property improvement or a car or whatever ... There's no-one checking whether I spend the money on property improvement or a car loan or beer and sweets or whatever.

They don't care, it's a tick box - as long as I'm creditworthy, I'll get the loan.

As simple as what, exactly?

Bank lending is hardly regulated at all in terms of limits - except, of course, for interest rates.

What, exactly, is incompatible?

It's not simplistic at all, it's how things are.

I agree, private sector credit creation should be regulated; but it isn't.

The limit is ... How many creditworthy customers are prepared to pay the current price of money.

That's the reality of private sector credit creation.

They aren't immutable laws of nature; the EU will "arrange" applicable legislation in any way it chooses to fit it's best interests.

If the worst happens and the UK applies to rejoin, you can expect opt outs to be conceded.

Are you saying banks turn away creditworthy customers willing to pay the current price of money?

Of course it can.

The UK negotiated opt outs on its inclusion.

Nah, with the EU, everything is potentially negotiable. Best avoided altogether.

Realistically, an iscot needs a govt which will use it's fiscal and legislative capacity to organise the resources at its disposal for the public good; otherwise it's more suffering under the neoliberal yoke.

No need for a terrarium, just observe them in power now.

I suppose it depends what opt outs can be negotiated but, anyway, the EU is an anti democratic, austerity based, neoliberal institution and should be avoided at all costs.

Banks will continue lending until the last person willing to pay the current price of money signs a loan agreement.

What do you think the "legal limits"are?

Brand new #MacroNCheese episode 375
"(R)evolutionary Struggle" out now on the Real Progressives #Substack and our RP website!

Links in comment below. ⬇️

#MMT #revolution #classwar

Tell them they've had their turn and now it's ours.

Let me know how it goes 👍

A laudable ambition but it relies on the ruling class abdicating their power and wealth peacefully.

We don't live in a democracy, we never have.

The UK has a Uniparty, voting for one wing or another makes no difference at all - same in US, see Gilens and Page study.

There's no salvation in the current political landscape.